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slyshon

All new Pathfinder 2005

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Really nice boat. Package it w single axel swing trailer and it might be garageable for alot of guys. 

I’d offer some kind of option to close in that huge splash well. Seems kinda odd on a boat that size to not be able to walk across the back deck. At one point you even saw Charlie start to walk the tight rope and then hopped down. 

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Great rig with a lot of nice features. I like the midship cleats and access to them, the aft cup holders and rod holders, and a lot of other little upgrades. When I give my HPS to my kid in 15 years, I'll pick one of these up. I'll be ready for a smaller boat by then. 

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11 hours ago, justfish said:

Really nice boat. Package it w single axel swing trailer and it might be garageable for alot of guys. 

I’d offer some kind of option to close in that huge splash well. Seems kinda odd on a boat that size to not be able to walk across the back deck. At one point you even saw Charlie start to walk the tight rope and then hopped down. 

While you're correct I really like the amount of space it gives you behind the leaning post. I would like to be able to walk across the rear deck though. maybe a little wider and you can keep the space to walk around the leaning post. 

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Beautiful boat!  Nicely done!  The cockpit space behind the leaning post is great!  Need some more photos of the lines of the hull - out of the water too.  The vee (did I hear 16 degree?) hull, stern, keel, pad, pocket...?

Edit: Just saw the Running Video, which shows more of the lines of the hull.  Saw more of what I wanted to see.  Love it!

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Cool to see a boat this size re-introduced to the lineup.  Keeping a boat in the garage is nice and you all were obviously considering this in the design aspect with the flip down windshield and grab bar.  I like it! 

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Interested in seeing the performance numbers with the 115. Fuel economy should be impressive. She would scoot with a 150.  

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I have a 2006 2000v.  The boat is great for what I use it for.  There are other boats (larger Pathfinders) I'd love to have but this boat is enough for me.  However, there are a few things on my boat that I'd love to have designed differently and or corrected. Curious if the new 2005 has made those changes?  

1.  Porpoising...  This boat doesn't like much weight in the back and this characteristic has been discussed at length.  I can live with this issue on my boat as I just use some tabs but I wouldn't want to fight it in another boat.

2.  Prop Wash...  It seams that since my tabs are mounted off the transom and not in a pocket, I get some aerated water at the prop when making tight turns.  I guess some call it prop blow-out.  Another item I'd prefer not to deal with on my next boat.

3.  Storing long rods in secured hatch...  I love the new side hatch setup (hinged at the front) but it looks like it is for gear storage and not rod storage.  Would love to be able to store up to 8' rods in a hatch that can be locked.  In my current boat, I had to cut out a hole in the front bulkhead which allows the rod tips to extend up into the anchor locker.  Not the best setup but it works.  Just cannot hang a sea-claw up front because it has a tendency to fall from it's spot which could destroy some rod tips.  

4.  Water in the cockpit floor...   It's a boat that is surrounded by water.  Water is going to get in the floor.  I get it.  Not a huge issue but I think that design is a part of the reason it happens.  If we have plenty of weight in the back of the boat and/or have the motor in reverse, it's possible for water to come back through the floor drains.  Yes I have the Radbuds  which is a great help but it isn't 100% effective.  Still get water from time to time.

5.  Wiring/chase...  The wiring in my boat is a clustered up mess but it is way better than most boats.  Wish the boat had a real clean wiring setup with decent size chases to move new wires in and out.  My battery switch is in the rear starboard hatch but I put another switch at the CC.  Eventually, I need to eliminate the original switch as it remained as a pass-thru.  It does look like the new switches are at the CC as well as an addition of a TM switch.  Good move.

Just a few minor things that I'd like changed.  Looks like the 2005 has addressed some.  Unknown on the water in cockpit, transom mounted tabs and porpoising issues.  I had thought that my next boat might be the 2500 after waiting a few years for the used prices to get into my wheelhouse but this 2005, with changes, could be an option.  

 

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I'm not sure on most of your list because I've never had a Pathfinder. From what I could see in the running video of the 2005, it looks like MBG has removed the transom pocket. That should create more buoyancy and stern lift. That along with the console moved slightly forward makes for a good balance, and should eliminate porpoising. No problem adding a Jack Plate either. Probably allows the boat to sit higher in the water and help with cockpit drainage as well. It looks like an awesome 20-footer to me!

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Lots of work in a pocket transom design , the pocket design is adding set back without losing as much draft as getting the same amount of set back with a jackplate because you still have buoyancy (top of pocket) when not at speed . The pocket transom has a advantage because it allows the motor to be installed higher. Some pocket drive hulls can create a vacuum unless they figure a way to vent the pocket drive the maverick ,action marine,action craft, fountains, Allison’s , all use some sort of vent in the pocket . In most cases a pocket hull is faster than a non pocket design because of added bow lift and the ability to mount the motor higher . 

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5 hours ago, dabear said:

Lots of work in a pocket transom design , the pocket design is adding set back without losing as much draft as getting the same amount of set back with a jackplate because you still have buoyancy (top of pocket) when not at speed . The pocket transom has a advantage because it allows the motor to be installed higher. Some pocket drive hulls can create a vacuum unless they figure a way to vent the pocket drive the maverick ,action marine,action craft, fountains, Allison’s , all use some sort of vent in the pocket . In most cases a pocket hull is faster than a non pocket design because of added bow lift and the ability to mount the motor higher . 

Joe, you are like a Kung Fu Master on this forum, and I am more like Grasshopper.  But I think I can snatch the pebble from your hand on this one, and respectfully disagree.  Jack plates are here to stay.  I wouldn't have a boat without one, as long as the boat was designed to accommodate it.  Bob's Machine Shop just came out with a cool new JP that has a kick-back option to protect your motor (and transom) when it hits a submerged object.  Back before jack plates became popular, I think Action Craft was one of the first companies to offer a small transom pocket as a way to create built-in setback and allow the motor to be mounted higher for shallower running without the prop losing grip.  Then it was copied by many boat companies, and the pockets got bigger, deeper and wider.  At the same time, jack plates started coming on strong, and outboards got heavier with the popularity of 4-strokes.  Since adding a pocket to a boat hull subtracts from displacement and running surface below the water line, it reduces stern lift under way and buoyancy while at rest.  The combination of reduced stern lift and buoyancy, too much setback with a pocket AND jack plate, and a heavy 4-stroke hanging further back on the jack plate - has been a recipe for deeper draft, weight balance issues, stern squat, hull slap, slower hole shot, prop ventilation and porpoising.
On the other hand, you can look at the new Pathfinder 2005 running video and see that the boat has so much stern lift and buoyancy that it almost looks like it's begging for a bigger, heavier motor and a jack plate.  That thing jumps up on plane really fast with hardly any bow rise!  That's an awesome improvement!  IMO, you can have it all - a fishing boat with good balance and high performance that is stable at all speeds and choosing a prop is easy and painless.  You want the fastest speeds, lift and efficiency in a hull?  Add a pad on the keel - even a bustle transom - but not a pocket.  To me, it's better to have the option of adding a jack plate to a hull without a pocket, than to have balance and porpoising problems because you added a jack plate to a hull with a pocket.  Sorry buddy, had to add my 2 cents...

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There are things I like about the design (overall package, narrow console, lots of features) and some things that am not too thrilled about (rear deck, probably the price). But think until I get a chance to see it in person is difficult to really have an opinion. Hoping it is a really nice, probably will want a smaller boat in about 5 years as age makes a larger boat not so fun to deal with.

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Both Dabear and Geeviam have great points about pockets in the rear. I think both of you are right but I wonder about the design and size of the pockets on different models. I have a 16' boat and my pocket size looks to be the same size and dimensions as my friends 22' pathfinder? If this takes away from buoyancy and cause porpoising issues then why wouldn't the 16' boat have a smaller pocket? I think Dabear has a small pocket and he has an 18' (HPX) boat which is in the middle of the two mentioned above. Do HPX's have porpoising issues? Would a smaller pocket like on the HPX be better on my 16' RF so it would not porpoise like it does but still let me run my engine higher and get the benefits of a pocket drive? You mentioned action craft starting the pocket drive and I know people with them. They have never mentioned porpoising issues with there pocket drive boats. Lots of questions and theories about why our boats porpoise like they do and its not just one or two boats or models.

As for jackplates, all boats I have get jackplates and trim tabs. It's like buying a new truck, first thing you do is shop for bigger wheels and tires and tint the windows.

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27 minutes ago, lurem said:

Both Dabear and Geeviam have great points about pockets in the rear. I think both of you are right but I wonder about the design and size of the pockets on different models. I have a 16' boat and my pocket size looks to be the same size and dimensions as my friends 22' pathfinder? If this takes away from buoyancy and cause porpoising issues then why wouldn't the 16' boat have a smaller pocket? I think Dabear has a small pocket and he has an 18' (HPX) boat which is in the middle of the two mentioned above. Do HPX's have porpoising issues? Would a smaller pocket like on the HPX be better on my 16' RF so it would not porpoise like it does but still let me run my engine higher and get the benefits of a pocket drive? You mentioned action craft starting the pocket drive and I know people with them. They have never mentioned porpoising issues with there pocket drive boats. Lots of questions and theories about why our boats porpoise like they do and its not just one or two boats or models.

As for jackplates, all boats I have get jackplates and trim tabs. It's like buying a new truck, first thing you do is shop for bigger wheels and tires and tint the windows.

Good points Dale.  Right-on!

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Checked one out at my local boat shop the evening. I was impressed overall. It's a lot of boat for a 20 footer.  The large splash well in the back deck wasn't an issue, as you can easily step from one side to the other over the splash well. The overall lines and freeboard differ from the original 20 and the 22, it looks more like a deep v boat than a traditional bay boat to me. I wonder what the draft and all will be? I really like the lines of the previous 20 and 22' pathfinders compared to 2005 lines. 

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On July 27, 2018 at 11:47 AM, rubble said:

I have a 2006 2000v.  The boat is great for what I use it for.  There are other boats (larger Pathfinders) I'd love to have but this boat is enough for me.  However, there are a few things on my boat that I'd love to have designed differently and or corrected. Curious if the new 2005 has made those changes?  

1.  Porpoising...  This boat doesn't like much weight in the back and this characteristic has been discussed at length.  I can live with this issue on my boat as I just use some tabs but I wouldn't want to fight it in another boat.

2.  Prop Wash...  It seams that since my tabs are mounted off the transom and not in a pocket, I get some aerated water at the prop when making tight turns.  I guess some call it prop blow-out.  Another item I'd prefer not to deal with on my next boat.

3.  Storing long rods in secured hatch...  I love the new side hatch setup (hinged at the front) but it looks like it is for gear storage and not rod storage.  Would love to be able to store up to 8' rods in a hatch that can be locked.  In my current boat, I had to cut out a hole in the front bulkhead which allows the rod tips to extend up into the anchor locker.  Not the best setup but it works.  Just cannot hang a sea-claw up front because it has a tendency to fall from it's spot which could destroy some rod tips.  

4.  Water in the cockpit floor...   It's a boat that is surrounded by water.  Water is going to get in the floor.  I get it.  Not a huge issue but I think that design is a part of the reason it happens.  If we have plenty of weight in the back of the boat and/or have the motor in reverse, it's possible for water to come back through the floor drains.  Yes I have the Radbuds  which is a great help but it isn't 100% effective.  Still get water from time to time.

5.  Wiring/chase...  The wiring in my boat is a clustered up mess but it is way better than most boats.  Wish the boat had a real clean wiring setup with decent size chases to move new wires in and out.  My battery switch is in the rear starboard hatch but I put another switch at the CC.  Eventually, I need to eliminate the original switch as it remained as a pass-thru.  It does look like the new switches are at the CC as well as an addition of a TM switch.  Good move.

Just a few minor things that I'd like changed.  Looks like the 2005 has addressed some.  Unknown on the water in cockpit, transom mounted tabs and porpoising issues.  I had thought that my next boat might be the 2500 after waiting a few years for the used prices to get into my wheelhouse but this 2005, with changes, could be an option.  

 

your porpoising issue could be solved by having a little more cup worked into your prop. 

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